60 Nanoseconden sneller dan het licht

Alles puur natuur nier ;-)
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Lid geworden op: di 11 jan 2011, 23:28

di 22 nov 2011, 07:35

Doubts cast on faster-than-light neutrinos experiment

Measurements by Gran Sasso physicists suggest neutrinos cannot have travelled faster than the speed of light

The idea that subatomic particles can travel faster than the speed of light in contravention of the currently accepted laws of physics has been dealt a serious blow by researchers who share the lab of the team that made the original finding.

In September, physicists working on an experiment called Opera at the Gran Sasso laboratory in Italy announced that neutrinos sent there from Cern near Geneva seemed to complete the 450 mile (720km) journey faster than a beam of light.

The group went on to refine their experiment and reported on Friday that the ghostly particles still appeared to be breaking nature's speed limit in a troubling violation of Einstein's theory of special relativity that would allow information to be sent back in time and so play havoc with the principle of cause and effect.

But measurements by a competing team of physicists at the Gran Sasso laboratory now suggest the neutrinos cannot have travelled faster than the speed of light as they hurtled through the Earth from Switzerland to the Gran Sasso lab near Rome in central Italy.

The team, who work on an experiment called Icarus, tested an argument described in a recent paper by Andrew Cohen and Sheldon Glashow at Boston University, who argued that faster-than-light or "superluminal" neutrinos would lose energy by spewing out electrons and their antimatter partners called positrons. Professor Glashow shared the Nobel prize for physics in 1979.

When Maddalena Antonello and others on the Icarus team analysed the energy of the neutrinos arriving at Gran Sasso, they found no evidence that they had lost energy the way Cohen and Glashow predicted. The finding has bolstered the view of many physicists who believe the Opera result is an error of measurement.

"Cohen and I argue that superluminal neutrinos ... must produce electron - positron pairs. They do not ...Thus, we conclude that the neutrinos are NOT superluminal" Prof Glashow told the Guardian. He went on to add that if neutrinos did travel faster than light "we would have to abandon much of what we think we know, much more than 'just' special relativity."

Jim Al-Khalili, a professor of physics at the University of Surrey who pledged to eat his boxer shorts live on television if the Opera result was proved true, was similarly sceptical that neutrinos can move faster than light.

"Opera measures the time of neutrino travel and hence their speed, whereas Icarus - who also detect the same neutrino beam - measure the spread in energy of the arriving neutrinos. They found that the neutrinos don't lose energy on their route. The problem of course is that they should do, if they were travelling faster than light. This is the equivalent of the sonic boom when something goes faster than sound."

"Usually we see this effect when particles go faster than light through transparent media like water, when light is considerably slowed down. It's called Cerenkov radiation. So these neutrinos should have been spraying out particles like electrons and photons in a similar way if they were going superluminal - and in the process would be losing energy. But they seemed to have kept the energy they started from, which rules out faster-than-light travel."

Matt Strassler, professor of theoretical physics at Rutgers University in New Jersey, said the Icarus results did not completely rule out faster-than-light neutrinos. "Cohen-Glashow and Icarus have shown that if Opera is correct, and Einstein's relativity must be modified, then that modification must also cleverly eliminate the Cerenkov-like radiation that would have affected both Opera and Icarus. That's a very tall order, to be sure; but until someone proves that no such modification is possible, we can't firmly conclude Opera is wrong," he said.

The idea that subatomic particles can travel faster than the speed of light in contravention of the currently accepted laws of physics has been dealt a serious blow by researchers who share the lab of the team that made the original finding.

In September, physicists working on an experiment called Opera at the Gran Sasso laboratory in Italy announced that neutrinos sent there from Cern near Geneva seemed to complete the 450 mile (720km) journey faster than a beam of light.

The group went on to refine their experiment and reported on Friday that the ghostly particles still appeared to be breaking nature's speed limit in a troubling violation of Einstein's theory of special relativity that would allow information to be sent back in time and so play havoc with the principle of cause and effect.

But measurements by a competing team of physicists at the Gran Sasso laboratory now suggest the neutrinos cannot have travelled faster than the speed of light as they hurtled through the Earth from Switzerland to the Gran Sasso lab near Rome in central Italy.

The team, who work on an experiment called Icarus, tested an argument described in a recent paper by Andrew Cohen and Sheldon Glashow at Boston University, who argued that faster-than-light or "superluminal" neutrinos would lose energy by spewing out electrons and their antimatter partners called positrons. Professor Glashow shared the Nobel prize for physics in 1979.

When Maddalena Antonello and others on the Icarus team analysed the energy of the neutrinos arriving at Gran Sasso, they found no evidence that they had lost energy the way Cohen and Glashow predicted. The finding has bolstered the view of many physicists who believe the Opera result is an error of measurement.

"Cohen and I argue that superluminal neutrinos ... must produce electron - positron pairs. They do not ...Thus, we conclude that the neutrinos are NOT superluminal" Prof Glashow told the Guardian. He went on to add that if neutrinos did travel faster than light "we would have to abandon much of what we think we know, much more than 'just' special relativity."

Jim Al-Khalili, a professor of physics at the University of Surrey who pledged to eat his boxer shorts live on television if the Opera result was proved true, was similarly sceptical that neutrinos can move faster than light.

"Opera measures the time of neutrino travel and hence their speed, whereas Icarus - who also detect the same neutrino beam - measure the spread in energy of the arriving neutrinos. They found that the neutrinos don't lose energy on their route. The problem of course is that they should do, if they were travelling faster than light. This is the equivalent of the sonic boom when something goes faster than sound."

"Usually we see this effect when particles go faster than light through transparent media like water, when light is considerably slowed down. It's called Cerenkov radiation. So these neutrinos should have been spraying out particles like electrons and photons in a similar way if they were going superluminal - and in the process would be losing energy. But they seemed to have kept the energy they started from, which rules out faster-than-light travel."

Matt Strassler, professor of theoretical physics at Rutgers University in New Jersey, said the Icarus results did not completely rule out faster-than-light neutrinos. "Cohen-Glashow and Icarus have shown that if Opera is correct, and Einstein's relativity must be modified, then that modification must also cleverly eliminate the Cerenkov-like radiation that would have affected both Opera and Icarus. That's a very tall order, to be sure; but until someone proves that no such modification is possible, we can't firmly conclude Opera is wrong," he said.

http://www.guardian.co.uk/science/2011/ ... nos-doubts
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Lid geworden op: za 21 aug 2010, 21:27

wo 23 nov 2011, 23:03

Afbeelding

Gaan we weer? wel, niet, graai, wel, niet, graai.
Tegengeluid: neutrino’s níét sneller dan het licht

De verwarring is groot, er staat ook veel op het spel: de moderne natuurkunde
woensdag 23 november 2011
Door: Gerard Driehuis

Categorie: Wetenschap
http://www.welingelichtekringen.nl/1666 ... licht.html


Het kan niet waar zijn dat neutrino’s sneller gaan dan het licht. Fysici van het Italiaanse ICARUS-experiment zeggen daarvoor bewijs te hebben, schrijft (o.a.) NRC
Dat ICARUS-experiment wordt uitgevoerd vlak bij het OPERA-experiment, dat beweert dat neutrino’s sneller dan het licht reizen. Net als bij OPERA wordt de ICARUS-detector bestookt met neutrino’s die afkomstig zijn van de 730 km verder gelegen SPS deeltjesversneller van CERN bij Genève.
Alleen maten de ICARUS-fysici daarvan niet de snelheid, maar de energie. En daarin zit de crux, zeggen zij. Want in september liet Nobelprijswinnaar Sheldon Glashow zien dat neutrino’s die sneller dan het licht door de aardkorst reizen, onderweg energie verliezen. Volgens ICARUS doen ze dat niet. En als ze geen enegrie kwijt zijn, dan kunnen ze de lichtsnelheid niet hebben doorbroken.
De verwarring is kortom groot, en er staat ook veel op het spel – de moderne natuurkunde die rust op de aanname dat niets sneller gaat dan het licht.

Bronnen: NRC Betaald, Bioscolar
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do 24 nov 2011, 00:46

"En daarin zit de crux, zeggen zij. Want in september liet Nobelprijswinnaar Sheldon Glashow zien dat neutrino’s die sneller dan het licht door de aardkorst reizen, onderweg energie verliezen. "

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vr 25 nov 2011, 05:23

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Faster Than Light!

By HUGO GERNSBACK
http://blog.modernmechanix.com/2010/12/ ... han-light/

IT may come as a shock, to most students of science, to learn that there are still in the world some scientists who believe that there are speeds greater than that of light.

Since the advent of Einstein, most scientists and physicists have taken it for granted that speeds greater than 186,300 miles per second are impossible in the universe. Indeed, one of the principal tenets of the relativity theory is that the mass of a body increases with its speed, and would become infinite at the velocity of light. Hence, a greater velocity is impossible.

Among those who deny that this is true, there is Nikola Tesla, well known for his hundreds of important inventions. The induction motor and the system of distributing alternating current are but a few of his great contributions to modern science. In 1892, he made his historic experiments in Colorado; where he manufactured, for the first time, artificial lightning bolts 100 feet long, and where he was able, by means of high-frequency currents, to light electric lamps at a distance of three miles without the use of any wires whatsoever.

Talking to me about these experiments recently, Dr. Tesla revealed that he had made a number of surprising discoveries in the high-frequency electric field and that, in the course of these experiments, he had become convinced that he propagated frequencies at speeds higher than the speed of light.

In his patent No. 787,412, filed May 16, 1900, Tesla showed that the current of his transmitter passed over the earth’s surface with a speed of 292,830 miles per second, while radio waves proceed with the velocity of light. Tesla holds, however, that our present “radio” waves are not true Hertzian waves, but really sound waves.

He informs me, further, that he knows of speeds several times greater than that of light, and that he has designed apparatus with which he expects to project so-called electrons with a speed equal to twice that of light.

Coming from so eminent a source, the statement should be given due consideration. After all, abstract mathematics is one thing, and actual experimentation is another. Not so many years ago, one of the world’s greatest scientists of the time proved mathematically that it is impossible to fly a heavier-than-air machine. Yet we are flying plenty of airplanes today.

Tesla contradicts a part of the relativity theory emphatically, holding that mass is unalterable; otherwise, energy could be produced from nothing, since the kinetic energy acquired in the fall of a body would be greater than that necessary to lift it at a small velocity.

It is within the bounds of possibility that Einstein’s mathematics of speeds greater than light may be wrong. Tesla has been right many times during the past, and he may be proven right in the future. In any event, the statement that there are speeds faster than light is a tremendous one, and opens up entirely new vistas to science.

While it is believed by many scientists, today, that the force of gravitation is merely another manifestation of electromagnetic waves, there have, as yet, been no proofs of this. There are, of course, many obscure tilings about gravitation that we have not, as yet, fathomed, At one time, it was believed by many scientists that the speed of gravitation is instantaneous throughout the universe. This is simply another way of putting it that there are speeds greater than light.

Yet, from a strictly scientific viewpoint, no one today has any idea how fast gravitational waves—always providing that the force is in waves—travel. If the moon, for instance, were to explode at a given moment, how long would it be before the gravitational disturbance would be felt on earth? Would the gravitational impulse or waves travel at the speed of light—that is, 186,000 miles per second—or would the effect be instantaneous? We do not know.

The entire subject will no doubt arouse a tremendous interest in scientific circles. It is hoped that other scientists will be encouraged to investigate Dr. Tesla’s far-reaching assertions; either to definitely prove or to disprove them.

The patent may be found here
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za 17 mar 2012, 04:25

En jahoor:

Razendsnelle deeltjes blijken meetfout
http://www.nu.nl/wetenschap/2765206/raz ... tfout.html

Ik gok dat men binnenkort weer met een nieuw bedacht verzinsel komt om de huidige theorie *kuch* werkend te houden... Een soort van formuleachtig zwart kacht gebasseerd op tijd ofzo.
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za 17 mar 2012, 05:03

de binnnenste buiten zwaarte kracht heeft veel weg van speudo-tensor die achter af ook daar was....
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za 17 mar 2012, 06:05

Ja hoor, een paar honderd miljard voor een overmaatse ringkerntrafo en bijbehorend speelgoed en dan nog durven die rolstoelers met droge ogen beweren dat ze meetfouten maken.

Straks bestaat dat Boss Hoggs deeltje ook niet ..... wat moeten we dan doen? Dan plettert het hele universum in elkaar ..... :sick:
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za 17 mar 2012, 07:20

alleen Bill Hicks universe bestaat:

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za 17 mar 2012, 08:18

dit is de volgende die ze gaan bouwen

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[YES]Equality of Opportunity - [NO]Equality of Outcome
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za 17 mar 2012, 16:21

[quote=""fr3bzy" post=52641"]dit is de volgende die ze gaan bouwen

Afbeelding
[/quote]

Is al eens gebouwt... Die Glocke!!
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wo 21 mei 2014, 19:07

#Podcast 019 #Bump!
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di 27 mei 2014, 22:20

In de erfenis der eeuwen ligt veel wijsheid opgetast. Ook hier geldt: dwaas is hij die zijn eigen geschiedenis versmaadt.
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di 16 dec 2014, 15:16

Can anything travel faster than the speed of light? 'Lightning' seen sparking from a supermassive black hole appears to break the laws of physics

Gamma ray bursts spotted spewing from black hole in galaxy IC 310
Astronomers said bursts crossed event horizon faster than speed of light
Rays crossed in a few minutes, when they should have taken 25 minutes
But experts suggest beams appear to flicker at a faster rate than they are
Observations have allowed scientists to form new theories about what may lie inside black holes and the affect it has on the matter around it

By Richard Gray for MailOnline
Published: 15:38 GMT, 28 November 2014
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/sciencetech/ ... light.html


According to the laws of physics, the speed of light is a fundamental barrier that cannot be broken - nothing is supposed to be able to travel faster than it.

So astronomers were left baffled when they spotted powerful flashes of energy bursting out from the heart of a supermassive black hole at the centre of a galaxy 260 million light years from Earth.

Measurements of this gamma ray 'lightning' showed it was travelling across the event horizon - the boundary where nothing can escape the intense gravity of the black hole - at rates that appeared to be faster than the speed of light.

Afbeelding
Gamma radiation has been found to spark out of the supermassive black hole at the centre of the galaxy IC 310, similar to how lightning behaves during a thunderstorm, in a discovery that scientists believe has given them a glimpse of what lies inside black holes

While the gamma rays appeared to cross the event horizon within just a few minutes, scientists estimate it should have taken light 25 minutes to pass through the distance. This either suggests the gamma rays were travelling faster than the speed of light, or something else was going on.
Now, researchers believe they have gained a rare insight into something that is taking place below the event horizon of the black hole - giving them a glimpse of what may be going on inside.

The objects that lie at the heart of black holes by their very nature are mysterious objects as no light is able to escape, and so they appear as a dark space in the sky.

Scientists say current theories for what caused the gamma ray outbursts are insufficient to explain their observations, and so have developed a new theory for what lies beneath the event horizon.

'No object can suddenly light up its entire surface faster than light takes to travel across it,' said Julian Sitarek one of the scientists working on the project at the Institute for High Energy Physics (IFAE) in Barcelona.

Galaxy IC 310 lies within the Perseus constellation and has an active galactic nucleus that throws out radio waves into the surrounding space.

Astronomers using the Major Atmospheric Gamma-ray Imaging Cherenkov (Magic) on La Palma, in the Canary Islands, spent almost four hours observing huge bursts of radiation from this galaxy in 2012.

This is thought to be caused by matter falling into the massive black hole at the centre of IC 310.

Known as extragalactic jets, they are thought to be caused by particles being accelerated away from the event horizon by shockwaves created by the matter falling into the black hole.

However, the observations of IC 310 using Magic showed that gamma ray jets being emitted from the black hole were flickering at a rate far faster than could be explained in this way.

The flashes of radiation seemed to move 279 million miles across the event horizon in just 4.8 minutes.

At the speed of light, it should have taken 25 minutes to travel this distance.

The international team of scientists, whose research is published in the journal Science, instead suggest that the black hole must be spinning at high speeds with two jets extending from either side.

Much like viewing the beam from a lighthouse, it then seems to flicker at a faster rate than it is really spinning as there are multiple sources of radiation rather than just one.

bron, filmpje en meer: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/sciencetech/ ... light.html
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