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Hier tref je topics aan over de economie, banken en zaken die te maken hebben met de financiële wereld.
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Lid geworden op: di 01 nov 2011, 18:18

vr 12 apr 2013, 16:33

Dutch Delusion: Europe's Core, She Rots Some More

http://www.theautomaticearth.com/Financ ... -more.html

A report published Thursday by the real estate industry in the Netherlands states that the average home price is now 18% lower than it was at the peak in 2008, while detached homes lost 20%-25% (March 2013 YoY prices fell 6.8%, says Eurostat). A separate, earlier, report estimated that 20% of homes, or over 1 million, are now underwater.

Today's report comes hot on the heels of a study issued Wednesday by a government commission, which took a full year to prepare and 121 pages to explain what went wrong in the Dutch housing bubble, and what should be done now to correct it.

The core problem is simple: from 1995 to 2008 home prices more than tripled (rose 200%+). Hence, if we round off to a 20% drop from peak levels, or 60% from 1995 levels when prices were a third of what they were in 2008, there's still an increase of about 150% from the starting levels that needs to be dealt with. We can discount for, and let's be generous, perhaps 50% for overall price inflation, but that still leaves us with a 100% increase, which is quite a bit more than the 60% absorbed so far.

This means that, seen from the 2008 peak perspective, a 20% price fall has been completed, and another 33% drop is needed to get back to where it came from. Some may cite reasons why prices should remain elevated, but that smacks too much of the "this time is different" argument; one might as well argue the opposite. A main point raised is that demand outstrips supply, but demand is not what people want; it's what they will be able to afford. And the Dutch economy is shrinking.

Well, you see the problem by now, of course: like many other nations, the Dutch today feel quite strongly that they have suffered enough already, and someone somehow needs to revive the housing market. But like everyone else, the Dutch wish to wish away the problem of the not yet corrected part of the pricing model. In their case, they want 200% (1995+100%) to be the new normal (a.k.a. the new black).

Not surprisingly, the government report says that A) all parties are to blame, and B ) the government needs to get more involved, i.e. make sure loans become available for people who now can't get them, a.k.a. people who are not the most likely prime candidates to buy a home that's still some 33% overvalued. Though, admittedly, sucking in those last remaining suckers would prop up moribund builders, agents and lenders for a while longer. Whether that's a government's task is at the very least highly questionable (obviously, other countries, including the US, work on similar resuscitation efforts).

The most hilarious I've seen to date coming out of the Netherlands (a good second was:" build more homes"!) is the proposal for the government to artificially raise home rents so people will be more likely and tempted to buy a home. An act which, incidentally, has recently been stripped of its most flagrant artificial incentives.

Incentives like the 105%-110% mortgages offered by lenders to everyone who could fog a mirror, but more than that, the main one, a very generous mortgage interest deductibility system, which at some point had people believe they would be stealing from themselves if they didn't buy a home. The more you borrowed, the better off you were. The Dutch government stood by and did nothing (except count the extra tax revenue). And now a government committee says everyone's to blame, not just them. Incompetent inglourious lying basterds.

Throughout the western world it's been an active collaboration of the governments and the banks and the real estate industry and the builders. For private parties, it's just a nice one-off windfall (if you're the boss). But if tax rates remain the same, tripling home prices are such a windfall for any level of government that it's really worth it to encourage the madness where and whenever you can. It doesn't get more predictable than that. And neither does the follow-up: with prices, but especially sales, dropping off a cliff, tax revenue falls, and since there's nothing as addicted to anything as a government to taxes, services and benefits go out with the bathwater. But only after all lenders have been made whole (Dutch banks have mostly been nationalized) with the - largely future - tax revenues of the home buyers and their unborn progeny.

It's a very simple story really: this is a widespread tale of western societies transforming themselves into pyramid schemes; or perhaps we should say one big global Ponzi scheme. And these Ponzi things collapse, and there's nothing anyone can do to "fix" that: the poisoned chalice must and will be emptied to the last drop. Only, the politicians - legally - have their hands in everyone's pocket, so they can throw around trillions of dollars and euros to hide the process of the plunging system for as long as it lasts. That's where we're at right now.

And it's not that all of these folks have evil minds; the intelligence level of politicians in the Netherlands approaches zero as much as it does in other western countries. The issue is that the entire system has blinders on, the blinders of ever-lasting growth economic "education", and of when you have none, do what you can, sell your grandma if you must, to return to growth ASAP. A few who understand it could be labeled evil; the rest are all blinded by the lights of power. And at best completely useless when it comes to governing a society that is not growing rapidly and happily.

They can think in only one dimension, and that one-dimensional thinking can in the end lead to one end only: complete and utter disaster. It's everything on red every time and every day, and that's not how the world works. Every time black comes up is, for these people, nothing but another reason to put it all on red again next time. A surefire recipe for mayhem. But it's all they have ever learned.

Still, don't take my word for it. Christoph Schult and Anne Seith laid it out quite well in Der Spiegel last week:

Underwater: The Netherlands Falls Prey to Economic Crisis

"Underwater" is a good description of the crisis in a country where large parts of the territory are below sea level. Ironically, the Netherlands, widely viewed as a model economy, is facing the kind of real estate crisis that has only affected the United States and Spain until now. Banks in the Netherlands have also pumped billions upon billions in loans into the private and commercial real estate market since the 1990s, without ensuring that borrowers had sufficient collateral.

Private homebuyers, for example, could easily find banks to finance more than 100% of a property's price. "You could readily obtain a loan for five times your annual salary," says Scheepens, "and all that without a cent of equity." This was only possible because property owners were able to fully deduct mortgage interest from their taxes.

Instead of paying off the loans, borrowers normally put some of the money into an investment fund, month after month, hoping for a profit. The money was to be used eventually to pay off the loan, at least in part. But it quickly became customary to expect the value of a given property to increase substantially. Many Dutch savers expected that the resale of their homes would generate enough money to pay off the loans, along with a healthy profit.

More than a decade ago, the Dutch central bank recognized the dangers of this euphoria, but its warnings went unheeded. Only last year did the new government, under conservative-liberal Prime Minister Mark Rutte, amend the generous tax loopholes, which gradually began to expire in January. But now it's almost too late. No nation in the euro zone is as deeply in debt as the Netherlands, where banks have a total of about €650 billion in mortgage loans on their books.

Consumer debt amounts to about 250% of available income. By comparison, in 2011 even the Spaniards only reached a debt ratio of 125%.


The Netherlands is still one of the most competitive countries in the European Union, but now that the real estate bubble has burst, it threatens to take down the entire economy with it. Unemployment is on the rise, consumption is down and growth has come to a standstill. Despite tough austerity measures, this year the government in The Hague will violate the EU deficit criterion, which forbid new borrowing of more than 3% of gross domestic product (GDP).

It's a heavy burden, especially for Dutch Finance Minister Jeroen Dijsselbloem, who is also the new head of the Euro Group, and now finds himself in the unexpected role of being both a watchdog for the monetary union and a crisis candidate.

Even €46 billion in austerity measures are apparently not enough to remain within the EU debt limit. Although Dijsselbloem has announced another €4.3 billion in cuts in public service and healthcare, they will only take effect in 2014.

"Sticking the knife in even more deeply" would be "very, very unreasonable," Social Democrat Dijsselbloem told German daily Frankfurter Allgemeine Zeitung, in an attempt to justify the delay. It's the kind of rhetoric normally heard from Europe's stricken southern countries. The adverse effects of living beyond one's means have become apparent since the financial crisis began. Many of the tightly calculated financing models are no longer working out, and citizens can hardly pay their debts anymore. The prices of commercial and private real estate, which were absurdly high for a time, are sinking dramatically. The once-booming economy is stalling.


"A vicious cycle develops in such situations," says Jörg Rocholl, president of the European School of Management and Technology in Berlin and a member of the council of academic advisors to the German Finance Ministry. "Customers have too much debt and cannot service their loans. This causes problems for the banks, which are no longer supplying enough money to the economy. This leads to an economic downturn and high unemployment, which makes loan repayment even more difficult."

The official unemployment rate has already climbed to 7.7%. In reality, it is probably much higher, but that has been masked until now by a demographic group called the ZZP. The "Zelfstandigen zonder personeel" ("Self-employed without employees") are remotely related to the German model of the "Ich-AG" ("Me, Inc."). About 800,000 ZZPers currently work in the Netherlands. [..] (ED: at a working population of maybe 10 million.)

The Dutch have long been among Europe's most diligent savers, and in the crisis many are holding onto their money even more tightly, which is also toxic to the economy. "One of the main problems is declining consumption," says Johannes Hers of the Netherlands Bureau for Economic Policy Analysis (CPB) in The Hague, the council of experts at the Economics Ministry. His office expects a 0.5% decline in growth for 2013. Some 755 companies declared bankruptcy in February, the highest number since records began in 1981. The banking sector is also laying off thousands of employees at the moment.

Because of the many mortgage loans on the books, the financial industry is extremely inflated, so much so that the total assets of all banks are four-and-a-half times the size of economic output.


The main problem seems to be that the entire westworld economic system is based on belief alone. The Netherlands has become a society built entirely on delusion, and it's by no means the only one.

Recently, 80-year old Dutch somewhat-euro-sceptic right wing statesman Frits Bolkestein said that within 5 years, Germany, Holland et al should and would introduce a second currency besides the Euro. He was adamant France could not be part of it: "they're broke!". It seems to me, so is Holland. It must be an increasingly lonely time to be Angela Merkel.
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vr 12 apr 2013, 20:55

First Bitcoin, Now Gold: All Alternative Currencies Must Be Crushed


Gold prices just entered a bear market. Down 21% from their mid-2011 highs. Today's drop is the largest since 2/29/12 - LTRO2 and takes the price of the barbarous relic back to July 2011 lows. Silver is also seeing its biggest down-day since LTRO2 as it tests 2012 lows. Must. Destroy. All alternative currencies.

A bad day for commodities...

Afbeelding
Afbeelding

http://www.zerohedge.com/news/2013-04-1 ... be-crushed
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vr 12 apr 2013, 21:09

The Tunnel People That Live Under The Streets Of America


Submitted by Michael Snyder of The Economic Collapse blog,

Did you know that there are thousands upon thousands of homeless people that are living underground beneath the streets of major U.S. cities? It is happening in Las Vegas, it is happening in New York City and it is even happening in Kansas City. As the economy crumbles, poverty in the United States is absolutely exploding and so is homelessness.

Afbeelding

In addition to the thousands of "tunnel people" living under the streets of America, there are also thousands that are living in tent cities, there are tens of thousands that are living in their vehicles and there are more than a million public school children that do not have a home to go back to at night. The federal government tells us that the recession "is over" and that "things are getting better", and yet poverty and homelessness in this country continue to rise with no end in sight. So what in the world are things going to look like when the next economic crisis hits?

When I heard that there were homeless people living in a network of underground tunnels beneath the streets of Kansas City, I was absolutely stunned. I have relatives that live in that area. I never thought of Kansas City as one of the more troubled cities in the United States.

But according to the Daily Mail, police recently discovered a network of tunnels under the city that people had been living in...

Below the streets of Kansas City, there are deep underground tunnels where a group of vagrant homeless people lived in camps.

These so-called homeless camps have now been uncovered by the Kansas City Police, who then evicted the residents because of the unsafe environment.

Authorities said these people were living in squalor, with piles of garbage and dirty diapers left around wooded areas.


The saddest part is the fact that authorities found dirty diapers in the areas near these tunnels. That must mean that babies were being raised in that kind of an environment.

Unfortunately, this kind of thing is happening all over the nation. In recent years, the tunnel people of Las Vegas have received quite a bit of publicity all over the world. It has been estimated that more than 1,000 people live in the massive network of flood tunnels under the city...

lees verder...
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za 13 apr 2013, 22:57

Lache bij de ING...
Rudo de Ruijter

13 april 2013
http://www.courtfool.info/nl_Lache_bij_de_ING.htm


We kwamen van het ING-kantoor in Velp, waar we bijna een half uur op onze beurt hadden gewacht, toen de kas leeg bleek te zijn. Maar op het kantoor aan de Lange Wal in Arnhem hadden ze nog wel geld, zeiden ze. Wij erheen. Omdat we er weer lang moesten wachten, vroeg ik een medewerkster of ze nog geld hadden. Ze vroeg hoeveel we wilden en ging naar de kassier om na te vragen. Ja, er was nog genoeg om ons uit te betalen.

We waren aan de beurt. Onze identiteitsbewijzen werden gescand en we mochten onze bankpasjes invoeren. Ik aan het ene loket, mijn vriendin aan het loket ernaast. Mijn uitbetaling verliep vlekkeloos. Mijn vriendin wilde 10.000 euro in kleinere coupures. De kasmachine spuugde de eerste helft van haar biljetten uit en kuchte nog met de rest. De kassier telde de eerste helft alvast uit en schoof die in een envelop naar mijn vriendin. In een tweede envelop verzamelde hij de volgende biljetten. Maar wat hij ook deed, de machine stokte en er ontbraken nog steeds 2.350 euro. We wachtten aan de balie, terwijl er telefoontjes werden gepleegd. Na verloop van tijd kregen we een kopje koffie en thee aangeboden. De tijd verstreek. De kassier vertelde, dat hij niet kon zien, of de 10.000 euro nu wel of niet van de rekening waren afgeboekt. We hoorden hem tegen zijn collega zeggen dat er nog 401 biljetten in de machine moesten zitten, maar dat die administratief op nul stond. Ik stelde voor, dat ze een verklaring zouden opstellen, dat wij 5.000 euro ontvangen hadden en als er 10.000 afgeboekt waren, dat de ING ons nog 5.000 schuldig was. En als er niets afgeboekt was, dan kon ING de uitbetaalde 5.000 als nog afboeken.

Nee, ze waren niet bevoegd om zo'n verklaring te tekenen, dat kon niet. Het liep tegen sluitingstijd en het leek er niet op, dat het probleem spoedig werd opgelost. Gauw in de winkel ernaast maar een stuk kaas gehaald. Met een gevulde maag raak je minder gauw geïrriteerd. Via de telefoon kregen de kassiers instructies hoe ze de kasmachine konden openen om te zien of er een biljet vastgelopen was. De tijd verstreek. Of we de ontvangen 5.000 euro niet terug wilden geven en dan zouden zij uitzoeken of de 10.000 euro al dan niet afgeboekt waren. Nee, dat wilden we niet. "Stel maar een proces verbaal op, dat we maar 5.000 hebben ontvangen." Dat mocht niet van de rayonmanager, zei hij. Ik kreeg hem telefonisch te spreken. Ik legde hem uit dat de storing ons probleem niet was. Wij hadden geen haast en konden wachten tot het ontbrekende geld gebracht werd. We waren inmiddels meer dan twee en een half uur in de bank en mijn vriendin vroeg of ze even naar het toilet kon. Nee, dat kon niet. Ondertussen werd er nog steeds druk getelefoneerd. De kassier meldde ons, dat ze de politie erbij zouden halen. Kennelijk moesten we bang worden. Een tijdje later meldde hij dat de politie onderweg was. En toen dat niet hielp, ging hij eindelijk achter de computer zitten om de gevraagde verklaring te typen. Een collega nam het van hem over. Zij had telefonisch instructies gekregen hoe de verklaring opgesteld moest worden. Ze vroeg de kassier of de kasmachine nu wel of niet de bon van de uitbetaling had geprint. Ja, die bon was geprint. En terwijl twee agenten bij de buitendeur naar het verhaal van één van de medewerkers luisterden, werd tegen acht uur 's avonds eindelijk de gevraagde verklaring opgesteld en door de aanwezigen ondertekend. Drie en een half uur bij de ING. Lache.


Lees ook: Waarom je spaargeld van de bank halen?


Als u wenst, kunt u dit artikel vrij kopiëren, doorsturen of publiceren in kranten of op het internet.
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do 18 apr 2013, 14:38

'Redding Cyprus nekt Oost-Europese banken'

http://www.trouw.nl/tr/nl/4324/Nieuws/a ... nken.dhtml

doe wat Nigel zegt:



er wordt op dit moment onwijs veel geld uit europa gehaald.....

...want die hebben de mogelijkheid.

Om je geld in zwitserland weg te pakeren moet je minimaal 200000 en ook nog eens afzien van rente om een geheim nummer te krijgen.
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do 18 apr 2013, 22:54

illuminati of my own reality
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do 18 apr 2013, 22:56

Moody's blijft bezorgd over Griekse banken

de enige die bezorgd is, is je stemming! dus moody's sit on my face!!

stort gewoon veel geld bij ons,ondertussen maken we zorgen om ons balans..

http://www.telegraaf.nl/dft/nieuws_dft/ ... ken__.html


...ga naar zwitserland
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zo 28 apr 2013, 12:05

Everything Is Rigged: The Biggest Price-Fixing Scandal Ever

The Illuminati were amateurs. The second huge financial scandal of the year reveals the real international conspiracy: There's no price the big banks can't fix


Conspiracy theorists of the world, believers in the hidden hands of the Rothschilds and the Masons and the Illuminati, we skeptics owe you an apology. You were right. The players may be a little different, but your basic premise is correct: The world is a rigged game. We found this out in recent months, when a series of related corruption stories spilled out of the financial sector, suggesting the world's largest banks may be fixing the prices of, well, just about everything.


Lees Verder
Wees aardig tegen mensen als je omhoog klimt, want je komt ze weer tegen als je naar beneden gaat...
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vr 03 mei 2013, 11:41

http://www.beurs.com/2013/05/03/geeft-d ... -100/22238

Ronald Hendrickx 03/05/2013 10:54

De Federal Reserve heeft eindelijk het nieuwe briefje van $ 100 voorgesteld. Het nieuwe briefje zal in omloop komen op 8 oktober. De nieuwe design bevat onder andere een gouden inktpot en het getal 100 staat ook in goud geschreven. Wil de Federal Reserve daar iets mee zeggen?

Afbeelding

:unsure:
het is niet wat het lijkt,... het is veel erger
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wo 22 mei 2013, 12:44

De Ironie <img src=" class="emoji smilies" draggable="false" src="//cdn.jsdelivr.net/emojione/assets/3.1/png/64/1f923.png"> juist de man die niet goed Engels sprak krijgt een prijs:
"Minister Dijsselbloem heeft de Duidelijketaalprijs 2013 gewonnen, omdat hij het beste Engels spreekt. Voor het eerst is niet onderzocht welke BN'er zijn of haar Nederlands het best beheerst en gebruikt, maar is er naar de Engelse taal gekeken."
Maar natuurlijk wordt dat opgelost:
Opvallend is dat er eerder dit jaar was juist een discussie was over Dijsselbloems beheersing van de Engelse taal. De kwestie draaide om het gebruik van het woord 'template' dat blauwdruk betekent. Het woord werd gebruikt door een Britse journalist.

Hoewel Dijsselbloem het woord niet herhaalde, werd uit zijn antwoord geconcludeerd dat het reddingsplan voor Cyprus een blauwdruk was voor het oplossen van soortgelijke problemen in andere landen. Dijsselbloem ontkende dat later en zei dat hij het woord ´template´ niet had gebruikt. "Ik kende dat woord niet eens", zei hij bij Pauw & Witteman. De onderzoekers hebben dit geval niet meegenomen in hun oordeel, omdat de minister dat woord nooit in de mond heeft genomen.
http://www.thijssen-translations.eu/blo ... prijs-2013

[quote=""dodeca" post=70470"]groentje Dijsselbloem snapt het project nog niet in zijn geheel,krijgge binnekort cursus "Project" anders kan die oprotte.

Maw. meneer dijsselbloem uwe mot niet eerlijk zijn uwe mot boefje worden.Ik weet nog een goeie leraar voor uwe hij heet Henry en komme uit Caanaan.

Trouwens hoe uwe lulde bij pau pau is al een goed begin gaat zo door!

Afbeelding[/quote]
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do 23 mei 2013, 20:18

Tot de laatste snik zullen ze alle waarde uit je persen
Het bedrijf dat onze pingegevens verwerkt, Equens, wil informatie verkopen over in welke winkels we wat kopen en hoeveel we uitgeven.
http://nos.nl/data/nosop3/reader/510009_tab1.html
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vr 24 mei 2013, 11:58

Is voor België

Verlaging van de grensbedragen voor contante betaling
http://www.kpmg.com/be/en/issuesandinsi ... 206-7.aspx


De programmawet van 29 maart 2012 heeft het maximum bedrag voor contante betalingen verder beperkt. Het grensbedrag is vanaf 16 april 2012 verlaagd van 15.000 euro naar 5.000 euro. Deze limiet zal ten laatste op 1 januari 2014 verder worden verlaagd tot 3.000 euro.

De beperking geldt zowel voor de aankoop van goederen als – en dit is nieuw- voor dienstprestaties.

Vanaf 16 april 2012 mag de prijs van de door de handelaar verkochte goederen, evenals van dienstprestaties geleverd door een dienstverstrekker, voor een bedrag van 5.000 euro of meer, aldus niet meer contant worden betaald. Uitzondering geldt voor het voorschotbedrag, op voorwaarde dat dit bedrag 10% van de prijs van verkoop of van de dienstprestatie niet overstijgt en voor zover dit bedrag niet hoger is dan 5.000 euro.

Dit grensbedrag van 5.000 euro is van toepassing ongeacht of de verkoop of de dienstprestatie plaatsvindt in één verrichting of door meerdere verrichtingen waartussen een verband lijkt te bestaan.

Indien deze maatregel niet wordt nageleefd, zijn de handelaars of dienstverstrekkers verplicht de Cel voor Informatieverwerking (CFI) hierover in te lichten.

Een overtreding van deze cash – beperkingen kan worden gestraft met een geldboete.


Stéphanie Vandaele
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do 30 mei 2013, 12:29

Betalen om genaaid te worden <img src=" class="emoji smilies" draggable="false" src="//cdn.jsdelivr.net/emojione/assets/3.1/png/64/1f923.png">

Toezicht van DNB wordt flink duurder
30 mei 2013 12:19
http://www.nu.nl/economie/3487847/toezi ... urder.html


De Nederlandse financiële sector moet dit jaar fors meer betalen voor het toezicht van De Nederlandsche bank (DNB).

De eigen bijdragen van bijvoorbeeld banken, verzekeraars en pensioenfondsen tellen op tot circa 130 miljoen euro, bijna een kwart meer dan vorig jaar.

Dat blijkt uit cijfers op de website van DNB.

De kosten van het toezicht liggen dit jaar 12 procent hoger en lopen op tot 149 miljoen euro, terwijl de bijdrage van de overheid met een kleine 19 miljoen euro bijna een derde lager uitvalt. Daarom moeten de financiële instellingen zelf een groter deel van de kosten dragen.

De stijging van de toezichtskosten is volgens DNB vooral het gevolg van de financiële crisis. De toezichthouder breidt zijn capaciteit met 10 procent uit.
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di 11 jun 2013, 17:48

Moraliteit ∝ Vrijheid
Real eyes realize real lies!!
Natural Law: The REAL law of attraction | The end of all evil
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di 11 jun 2013, 19:45

[quote=""ThaViking" post=71821"]Everything Is Rigged: The Biggest Price-Fixing Scandal Ever

The Illuminati were amateurs. The second huge financial scandal of the year reveals the real international conspiracy: There's no price the big banks can't fix


Conspiracy theorists of the world, believers in the hidden hands of the Rothschilds and the Masons and the Illuminati, we skeptics owe you an apology. You were right. The players may be a little different, but your basic premise is correct: The world is a rigged game. We found this out in recent months, when a series of related corruption stories spilled out of the financial sector, suggesting the world's largest banks may be fixing the prices of, well, just about everything.


Lees Verder[/quote]

Everything Is Rigged, Continued: European Commission Raids Oil Companies in Price-Fixing Probe

linQ: http://www.rollingstone.com/politics/bl ... e-20130515
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